Who is the bad guy here?

Discussion in 'Advanced Craps' started by superricktoyou, Jul 15, 2019.

  1. twodicebilly, Jul 22, 2019

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    The truth of it is, you never know what is going to happen, so you do what you can.
    I dont know what others experiences are, but what I have seen the past 21/2 years is
    that guys that use the GTC do best if they are not very good shooters. They look like some one
    helped them some or they took a class, but they never got their dice to really stay together so they
    are not impacted by the constant double pitch.

    My two friends here have very good GTC shots and they shoot out of the hardways, and they hardly
    'ever win....one because he plays to long the other because no matter how I help him he is going to listen
    to Dom before me.... couple weeks ago he did contact Linaway so I hope that helps

    The only experience I have with the little joe shot is my experience and a few times with Rick. I have not
    played with any other guys that use it.

    TDB
     
    #301
  2. StooopidRicktoyou, Jul 22, 2019

    StooopidRicktoyou

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    You know how many times you said "I" and "ME" in the above post. Give it up man. It's all about you. Everyone on here are idiots except Rick and you. Everyone that plays craps in the world we are all idiots except you and Rick. How many times do you need to say "I don't care" when in fact you do care? If you didn't care then you wouldn't respond. Fucking MORON
     
    #302
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  3. tabletop123, Jul 22, 2019

    tabletop123

    tabletop123 Member

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    NOW you are making sense. We never know what is gonna happen when we toss the dice. However, we still try to toss as perfectly as possible in order to impart some measure of Influence to the roll.

    Of course, the dice coming to rest exactly as pre-set would be " Gold", but we know how THAT goes.

    Even though it's a MONUMENTAL task, MY OBJECTIVE is to get those primary & secondary hits.,Why settle for. Anything less? Just let The numbers flow as long as you avoid The Seven Out? Nope...not MY style. The problem with influencing the dice is that Dice flip & flop.

    Even the very best of shooters cannot keep a die from flipping out of the Tossing plane consistently enough to gain an advantage.

    We already know that TRUE On Axis is extremely rare, & more times than not....one die is gonna flip out of the Tossing plane no matter how " in tandem" the toss is. It is what it is.

    The other problem is that when using " Pairs" ( regardless of its a Heavy 7's set, or bi-axial set) you're gonna get those double pitches. Of course a double pitch using " Pairs in a bi-axial dice set MIGHT NOT end in a Seven Out. ( However, I still wouldn't put " pairs" on the dice)

    So....we know that if you use any Heavy Sevens dice set....the double pitch kills you,,,& also both dice pitching inwards, or outwards creates the " out of tossing plane" Seven out.

    So.... In MY opinion, a bi- axial dice set ( 2V, 3V, & X6's) are not the best dice sets to avoid the Seven out. ( At least NOT from a starting dice set, although you'd want to RESULT in one of those dice sets, when the dice come to rest, because they only contain two Sevens)
    If you are using a conventional Hardways set, ie 55/44, I think it would be best to permutate to a 4/5/ 5/4, or Vice Versa. That way you, beat the double pitch seven- out, & if both dice collapse inwards, or outwards....you also beat the 6/1 Seven Out.

    When I pre-set the dice ( even if I FORCE myself to start from a bi-axial dice set)..... I NEVER want to see a " Pair" on the dice.

    So.... MAYBE I stand corrected, because I think you mentioned something about a 3/5 5/3 dice set? Now, I WOULD use THAT Dice Set ALL DAY LONG...for the purposes stated above. 4/6, 6/4, 2/3, 3/2......ANY two numbers inverted in the dice set does the job.

    The GTC boys ALMOST had it right with the Hardways set, because they realize that most tosses won't be perfect. They simply didn't allow for the double pitch, or the inward, & outward collapse of the dice to avoid the 6/1 Seven Out.
    Close, but no cigar!!!

    Now, I do NOT claim any expertise. These are only MY opinions.
     
    #303
  4. twodicebilly, Jul 23, 2019

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    I really dont care where I start, except it is not a traditional hardway set.... I have done some
    test sessions and Linaway has looked at them and I had very good results starting from a
    3v set and a flying 2v. but then I am using the little joe shot.

    GTC it is just 3/5 5/3 or 5/4 4/5, my normal set changes like I make with the LJ shot dont
    work so with GTC I win or I lose with what I start with.

    TDB
     
    #304
  5. tabletop123, Jul 23, 2019

    tabletop123

    tabletop123 Member

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    3/5, 5/3 is just a PERMUTATION of the Hardways set. Are you saying that EVEN IF YOU use a permutated Hardways set, you still don't do well?
    Also, you mentioned starting from a 3V, & 2V set. Nothing wrong with that. I simply would not put a 3/3 on the 3V set, or a 2/2 on the 2V set. I would permutate both dice sets.

    I am of the opinion that the Little Joe shot is a wing em, fling em toss, but of course....it's only MY opinion.

    I have witnessed the Little Joe toss, & personally.....I wouldn't spend ten cents on it. Of course the practictioners of the toss would say: " I didn't see it tossed PROPERLY", or the person tossing it didn't have any skill, etc. , or You need to take a class, & watch the experts demonstrate it, etc. Nope.....not for ME!!!

    Certainly, " Pretty" looking tosses don't necessarily constitute influence, but FOR MYSELF.....I want the toss....AT THE VERY LEAST....to LOOK good.

    Little Joe toss is the ugliest toss that I have EVER witnessed!!!!
     
    #305
  6. twodicebilly, Jul 23, 2019

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    everyone has to decide what shot they will use..... you can have good rolls
    with either the GTC or LJ.........Two years ago i saw one of the instructors at
    BIloxi teaching his crew the little joe shot.....all i am going to say about that
    is i am not going to say anything about that.

    The LJ shot has some advantages..... less hassle by the casino staff, for me it
    is much eaiser to tract the dice, the relationship with the dice one to the other
    is better, you dont see that bounce right or left if your release was not square
    to the table.

    There is a difference for me.... but that is me, you have to do what works for you.

    With the GTC shot I most often start with 3/5 5/3 and I wont change that set
    unless for some reason I am stuck on a single pitch.

    TDB
     
    #306
  7. tabletop123, Jul 23, 2019

    tabletop123

    tabletop123 Member

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    Yeah....I know who that Instructor was. We'll just leave it at THAT!! Lol

    That is true about the Little Joe shot ( Easier to effortlessly distinguish between left/right die), because there is more skipping, & tumbling to the back wall, & the dice are tossed very low to the table, as opposed to more of a " Thud", smack, bouncing type action" that ya get with a GTC, or Parr type toss.

    To each his own. Still not MY kind of toss.
     
    #307
  8. The Midnight Skulker, Jul 23, 2019

    The Midnight Skulker

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    I discovered this variation only recently. :( My prefered position is SO, and I have had some (possibly only apparent) success with setting the V on top, then rotating the outside die a quarter turn away from me.
     
    #308
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  9. VDC

    VDC Member

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    Ah RAilRoad Pass... So me my GF and her son for to a mid week trip to Boulder Dam...On way back we are going to play at RR Pass...3 guys at tables and after a seven out 2 leave... We move into SL1 and SL2 and buy in for just $100...2 months prior i have 5 points to fire and made $1100 on my roll along with Bill D and Howard Rockn Roller and a few others that bill invited for a step dinner comp freebee... anyway i doubt the guy remembered me... i gave no card...anyway i buy in as my gal does $100 only $5 fire bet for me and she bets one too and $1 dealers... First roll a 4-3 seven when i wasn't trying to throw a seven.. i say dump the bowl to pick out 2 others... pit boss say shoot the damn dice. I say i will i just want 2 new ones...knowing i prolly set the point and PSO with the 2 i had...nonetheless he insisted i shoot. I was very polite, and he was rude... I asked him to treat me with respect.. i tossed and threw a 5... He say to stick. he can't shoot, he's done, give him back his Pass Line... never seen a contract bet returned...lmao...i asked for a comment card and he brought security out to watch me and if any issues i would be escorted I'm sure... I was nice and we colored up and i got card for complaint.. What a Prick... What a MF'r too...Fk him, very rude... hadn't even threw the dice yet before he was all over me..i was using a Dr Z2 shot so maybe he seen the way i gripped and shot the first shot and said, noway this MF gonna get us for $10k tonight...

    just my .02 worth...so some casinos are bad or have bad suits...

     
    #309
  10. The Midnight Skulker, Aug 17, 2019

    The Midnight Skulker

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    When Lucky Eagle, a Native American joint in a thriving forest clearing dubbed Rochester, WA, first opened they had to close the casino between 4 and 10 AM, probably to satisfy some "protect us from ourselves" clause in their pact with the state. As bewitching hour approached a suit would call "last shooter", and subsequently "last roll" if the hand did not end in time, in which case all unresolved bets including contract bets were returned. I never saw anyone try it, so I can only wonder what would happen if someone had tried to make a Come bet after the "last roll" call.
     
    #310
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  11. Liman

    Liman Member

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    that pit boss must have been married to the cunt that gave me a hard time at railroad pass.
     
    #311
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  12. DeMango, Aug 17, 2019

    DeMango

    DeMango Member

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    We really need supervisor names so we don’t get in the same position. PM’s are fine. For yourself too, if your mining say 50 casinos, you can’t expect to remember every thing.
     
    #312