What do you play for?

Discussion in 'Advanced Craps' started by Dave G Ct, May 20, 2018.

  1. Dave G Ct, May 20, 2018

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Koko
    If you want to play the Come be my guest.
    Hornhiyo making some good points.
    LID- I get ideas after reading that other board.lol
     
    #41
  2. James Hall, May 20, 2018

    James Hall

    James Hall Member

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    This is playing to lose less and when I say that the players that play this strategy get all bent out of shape
    I call this a play to win more
    I don't fixate on what I might lose , I focus on what I will win
    I find it easier to recoup with LARGER WINS than with , SMALLER LOSSES
    Play to win more not to lose less
    Many times fixating on the proper goal will bring about better results
     
    #42
    Last edited: May 21, 2018
  3. DeMango, May 20, 2018

    DeMango

    DeMango Member

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    $3 tables in Biloxi! Just sayin!
     
    #43
  4. von duck, May 21, 2018

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    Not a "winning" play? :cool: So, what is a "winning" play? :)
     
    #44
    Last edited: May 21, 2018
  5. basicstrategy777, May 21, 2018

    basicstrategy777

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    "A thousand flat bettors drop $25 on the layout. while this many odds layers start with $5 and augment it with $30 regardless of which number the shooter is trying to repeat. The totals at risk are equivalent since the averages for every 36 come-out rolls will be $900 either way -- 36x$25 flat or 12x$5 plus 24x$35 with odds.

    If break-even, $500 wins, and $500 losses are taken as reference levels, here's how the immutable laws of mathematics say the thousand players will fare after typical time at the rail.

    100 rounds: 445 flat bettors will be above break-even, 15 will be ahead by more than $500, and 29 be below $500; 489 odds layers will be above break-even, 19 will have won over $500, and 22 will have lost more than this.

    200 rounds: 422 flat bettors will be above break-even, 52 will have won over $500, and 108 will have lost at least $500; 484 odds layers will be above break-even, 70 will have made in excess of $500, and 81 will be this deep in the hole.

    500 rounds: 379 flat bettors will be above break-even, 112 will show profits greater than $500, and 275 will be wondering where the steam roller came from; 475 odds layers will be above break-even, 165 will be more than $500 to the good, and 198 will be this far down.

    The casino's theoretical earnings on each player are $0.34 per round with $25 flat, compared to $0.07 per round with $5 flat and $30 odds. After 100-, 200-, and 500-round sessions, respectively, the totals are $34, $68, and $170 for flat fans and $7, $14, and $35 for odds players..

    Applying the traditional criterion of house advantage to bets on don't pass or don't come, apportioning money between the flat and odds portions of a wager is clearly superior to betting an equivalent amount flat."



    777
     
    #45
  6. von duck, May 21, 2018

    von duck

    von duck Member

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    Yeah, at one place, and I highly recommend you avoid that one place. :cool:
     
    #46
  7. Mssthis1, May 21, 2018

    Mssthis1

    Mssthis1 Member

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    Dave: I'm going to assume you make a pass bet and place the 4/10. I'm also going to assume your bankroll is not unlimited.

    Using those assumptions wouldn't it make more sense to change to a set that produces more sixes and eights? Random dice produce 40% more 6/8 than 4/10. On the days when your toss is not on or it is on but not producing 4/10 you have a 40% better chance of hanging in there until you catch a hand.

    That and you're making a bet with a 1.52% HA instead of 6.67%.

    When you get enough bankroll built up to buy the 4/10 and survive the ups and downs better, switch back to your 4/10 strategy.

    Just a thought.
     
    #47
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  8. Dave G Ct, May 21, 2018

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Missthis1
    Thx.I do use a 6&8 one hit regression play at times. Yes they hit more even by accident.
     
    #48
  9. Mssthis1, May 21, 2018

    Mssthis1

    Mssthis1 Member

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    The wife and I really like Biloxi. If it was easier to fly there we'd always go to Biloxi instead of Vegas. It's a 14 hour drive to Biloxi verses a 2 1/2 hour nonstop flight to Vegas.:(
     
    #49
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  10. Neverquit, May 21, 2018

    Neverquit

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    From watching other players playing come bet plus odds vs place bets, many, many come bet players use 2X odds---which is clearly not to their advantage when it comes to payouts compared to a 15 place bet.
     
    #50
  11. TDVegas, May 21, 2018

    TDVegas

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    You cannot just ignore the huge advantage of the pass or come bet on come out when making this assessment. 8 ways to win that bet and only 4 ways to lose. No other bet in any game offers such an advantage for the player.

    It is only after the come bet “travels” to the point that your assessment would be valid. The power of the pass/come bet is in the comeout roll advantage. Hence the low 1.41% house edge of the bet.
     
    #51
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  12. tabletop123, May 21, 2018

    tabletop123

    tabletop123 Member

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    Yep...$3 Crapless at Road house in Tunica, also!

    I just have to find TIME to travel for 2-3 days! Household responsibilities have begun to get a bit more complicated ( G knows what I speak of...Personal stuff).
     
    #52
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  13. James Hall, May 21, 2018

    James Hall

    James Hall Member

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    One roll ,
    so we should play this bet based on the outcome of one roll ??
     
    #53
    Last edited: May 21, 2018
  14. KokomoJoe4, May 21, 2018

    KokomoJoe4

    KokomoJoe4 Member

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    I know what you mean there Dave, all my results are by accident.
     
    #54
  15. Neverquit, May 21, 2018

    Neverquit

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    Just as you cannot ignore the disadvantage of the come bets if a point is made. Come out 7 has been known to wipe out many previously placed come bets at one time.
     
    #55
  16. Bases loaded, May 21, 2018

    Bases loaded

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    This is why you need more ODDS.

    10X was adequate, because the majority of your bet was in odds, which is returned on the ComeOut se*en.

    3x4x5 odds makes the COME bet's advantage narrower.
     
    #56
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  17. DeMango, May 21, 2018

    DeMango

    DeMango Member

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    Dave, have you read the latest Irish thread just for you?
     
    #57
  18. TDVegas, May 21, 2018

    TDVegas

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    No come bettor ignores the fact that he knows his existing come bets are at risk of a 7 after a point has been made.

    You simply ignored the first part of a come bet in your assessment of why you like the place bet over the come bet regarding the payout of the two AFTER a point has been established.

    Come bet or place bet....these are simply a "to each his own" as far as which to play.

    The ONLY measurement gauge we have beyond personal preference as to which is a better bet is house edge...

    Odds bet 0% house edge
    Come bet 1.41% house edge
    Place 6-8...1.52%. Place 5-9....4.00%. Place 4-10...6.67%
     
    #58
    Last edited: May 21, 2018
  19. James Hall, May 21, 2018

    James Hall

    James Hall Member

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    seVen
     
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  20. Dave G Ct, May 21, 2018

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    DeMango
    Thx for the heads up. First of all where did this mysterious thread arrive from. I certainly did not see that post. When
    I ASKED HIM ABOUT IT HE RESPONDED I see SR gave you the results.
    He was quite defensive. Hey anyone can lose. But I had looked and never saw one mention of that Darksiders Ball.

    Then again you have Irish and a couple of decent players venturing into a session of dark play. We're they the only players.? No others would be shooting. So did they chart the table or jump in like a bunch of amateurs? YOU GUESSED it jumped right into a warm table .Amateur city!
    Is anyone surprised by the results?
     
    #60