Need table minimum to play prop bets?

Discussion in 'Prop Bets & Side Bets' started by jasonf, Mar 1, 2015.

  1. jasonf, Mar 1, 2015

    jasonf

    jasonf Member

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    I was at the $10 Crapless table at Hollywood in Toledo the other night, and it was cold. We went round and round the table for about 30 minutes and every shooter was out after 1 or 2 tosses.

    I wanted to stick around until it warmed up, but didn't want to risk anything significant since I had a pretty small bankroll for the evening. So, I decided to just keep feeding $1 on the hard 6 and 8, and parlay wins in hopes of seeing two in a row. It's bleeding, I know, but a slow bleed that kept me entertained while I waited.

    Shortly into my session, the stick swaps out and the new guy notices that I keep returning the hard ways but no other action. He informs me that the table minimum is $10, and that I can't keep booking $1 bets without having a $10 bet somewhere (he was cool enough about it, and said to just occasionally place a $10 bet, but couldn't give me any guidance for how often I needed to place a table minimum bet... but, apparently more often than just when it was my turn to shoot, or when I'm parlaying a $1 win into a $10 bet...).

    I've been called out in Vegas and other places about needing a Pass/Don't Pass in order to book a Fire Bet. But, I've never seen a dealer tell a player that they can't book a prop bet without also having the table minimum.

    Has anyone else heard of this?
     
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  2. Onautopilot, Mar 1, 2015

    Onautopilot

    Onautopilot Member

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    I don't understand why they would not want your high HA bet on the hard ways. I've never noticed a player being called out for that, but actually haven't seen a lot of players only making that bet. Next time ask them if you can make a $10 pass line and a $10 don't pass bet to qualify for the $1 hard way bets. I'm not saying that's a good strategy, but it would let you hang around as you say. You can't win anything on the doey/don't, and you expect to lose $10 once every 36 decisions when the bar number rolls, but it's extremely low variance. But, if it were me, I would just pick one of the line bets and go with that enough times to qualify you, if you think the table is cold, play the don't pass, and when you play the $1 hard ways, you would actually be hedging your don't bet when there was a point that matched your hard ways. Just some thoughts, not advice!
     
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  3. jasonf, Mar 1, 2015

    jasonf

    jasonf Member

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    This particular night, I was at a Crapless table, so there was no dark side (I got hooked on placing/buying the extreme outside numbers when the table is warm, which is why I've been hitting that table recently). But, this rule, if it exists, would not just apply to Crapless tables.

    And in reality, it was only that one dealer who ever said anything - the boxman and other dealers who rotated in made no mention (though, after a while, the table warmed up and I started placing the 3 and 11 more frequently, meeting the minimum... And after winning 1-2 parlayed hardways, I also started piggy-backing my $1 hardways to try to get the dealers in on my parlay action - which may helped them to forget the house rules for a bit, if that is indeed a rule).
     
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  4. Onautopilot, Mar 1, 2015

    Onautopilot

    Onautopilot Member

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    I should have paid more attention to your post, I didn't catch the crapless part. Glad you turned it around a little! I haven't played crapless craps in many years, Bob Stupak's casino in Vegas had one, the only one I have ever seen.
     
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  5. luxlogs, Mar 2, 2015

    luxlogs

    luxlogs Member

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    I get the same reaction in Indiana, must have a line bet before betting HW's, Fire or ATS. They Call it Flea Repellant.
     
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  6. jasonf, Mar 9, 2015

    jasonf

    jasonf Member

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    I heard a dealer explain to a new player the other night: if the table minimum is $10, you can reach that minimum by a single line/place bet, or a collective $10 across the props (like playing the numbers on Roulette). This explanation made more sense to me.
     
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  7. TDVegas, Mar 9, 2015

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    That's a good one
     
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  8. rudeboy99, Mar 9, 2015

    rudeboy99

    rudeboy99 Member

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    Ho ho ho!! Although fairly insulting, not to mention rude, Flea Repellent is a pretty humorous turn of a phrase. I've never run across a table or crew that insisted a minimum line bet before placing anything else...ever! I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but it certainly is piss poor management and counter-intuitive to any traditional games management where the basic idea is to get in action on the layout where the HA can sort it out. It's hard to believe that these toilets go belly up, but they do on a regular basis and one of the reasons is they fail to remember it's called the "hospitality industry" for a reason. Failing to give your customers a fair gamble is way wrong and stupid.;)
     
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  9. TDVegas, Mar 11, 2015

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    I would assume if the casino is giving you grief for only playing a couple dollars on side bets, the rationale is they don't want you occupying a spot on the table that might go to a bigger better. On a slow night I can't see this being a problem but on a busy night or table they likely want minimum betters or would rather keep that spot open instead of telling you to bet more or leave. I also don't know what the protocol is for players occupying a spot and not gambling or waiting only until they toss.
     
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  10. Harley, Mar 12, 2015

    Harley

    Harley Member

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    in Las Vegas casinos requiring a Flea Repellant minimum bet to play props are divided into 3 basic categories:

    1. Strip Resorts are in the casino business and they don't really care about a minimum bet for Prop action, they will let you gamble anyway you wish ... There are a few exceptions with a certain dealer or Box on a certain shifts

    2. Boulder Hiway and local casinos often require a Pass Line in order to make props -- they are normally sweat joints

    3. Downtown LV casinos are divided between those that want to be real casinos in the gambling business or sweat joints

    There is an easy solution to playing in sweat joints that require a flea repellent minimum bet - Place an equal amount on both the Pass Line and Don't Pass .... if you are scared of the 12 you don't belong on the table ... Only Sam's Town has balked at this kind of action
     
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  11. mycoalsmith, Mar 16, 2015

    mycoalsmith

    mycoalsmith Member

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    How busy was the table? If the table was crowded and you were taking up a spot that another player would be making more bets, I can somewhat see that, but if the table wasn't crowded, I'd say they just wanted more money out of you.

    If it were me, I would have done 1 of 2 things -

    1. Ask the Boxman if this was true. If the Boxman was the one who told me this rule, I would ask for the manager and ask if that is a rule. If it is a rule, see # 2.

    2. Vote with my feet. I'd pick up all my chips, turn around, and leave. On my way out, I might stop at the Players Club and ask to speak to the General Manager and see if they knew about this rule. If it is, tell them you won't ever be back.
     
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  12. jasonf, Mar 17, 2015

    jasonf

    jasonf Member

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    The table had spots open. It was cold, and people were pissed and walking away. (Being Crapless, there was no dark side to play).

    My curiosity in seeing if others had heard of this rule before was because I normally play props only in addition to some other minimum bet (pass line, place bet, etc), so I had never really tried to just play the hardways, and to play them under the table minimum to boot. It could just be a house rule, and since it's the only casino in town (or within an hour's drive, even), they can probably be stricter about such rules whereas, say, a Vegas strip casino has to compete for customers with neighbors that are walking distance away and would tend to be more relaxed.
     
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  13. jaydashotter, Mar 22, 2015

    jaydashotter

    jaydashotter Member

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    Yes, I have heard of that rule before. I reside in Michigan and travel and play a lot. To be honest, I appreciate casinos that enforce that rule, especially to people that just walk up to the table in the middle of a decent roll and constantly bet $1 prop bets slowing up the dice. However, in your case if the table was slow it should not have been a problem, considering you had already loss money on the table from previous play.

    However, I do think that you should never just rely on hard ways to get back. (Just my personal opinion) I know you mentioned you were slow rolling until the table heated up, but maybe you should have tried a $12 eight and 1 hard. That way you still making money in the event it come easy. You will be suprised how many dollars will escape your bankroll betting dollar at a time. Just consider how many time you threw in a $1 to replace your hard way. Each time you could have been putting chips in your rack. Good luck!
     
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