goatcabin - You are 1,000% correct - For beginners - the HardWay Dice Set is the most forgiving - However, unlike the 2V or the 3V - which only have 2 ways to 7-out - if the dice are kept on axis - The hardway set has 4 ways to 7-out - For other than " novices " the 3V dice set is a better alternative - And THEN comes the $ producing 2V dice set ! $...eE..$
While playing the hardways can bring quick money - it's not only the 7 out you have to worry about. With the hardways, not only will a 7 out take your chips off the table, but so will a soft number. I've seen some hardways hit 2 or 3 times, but more often than not, I've seen a hardway, then a soft, and then maybe a hardways again. You will win MORE if you press your first hardway win and IF it comes up again before a soft hit. But you WILL WIN, if you take some of your profit off the first win and maybe add a chip or two to the hardways. The second scenario guarantees a win and profit. The first scenario - you can win BIG . . . . . IF your hardway comes up again before a soft.
I have two approaches for playing hardways: I typically play the point plus two place bets - typically the 6 and 8. I will also put $1 on the hard 6 and hard 8. If a soft 6 or 8 is hit, I replace the bet from my place bet winnings. If the hardway hits, I will parlay it the first time and up it $5 each subsequent hit. My last trip to Vegas I was very successful doing this. I also have a habit of hopping the hardways for $1 each after each pass line win. So if the shooter makes his point - or if he throws a 7 or eleven on the come out - I will hop the hardways for $1 each. If they hit on the come out, I collect the $31 and put $5 on each hardway. A $4 investment (which comes from a previously winning bet) has turned into four $5 hardway bets with a potential payout of $35 or $45 each
I don't play these very often, but when I do I use the "Dice Doctor" progression. For hard six and eight, its $5, 25, 125, 625 and on up to table limit (by 5x) For hard four and ten, its $5, 20, 80, 320 and on up to table limit (by 4x)
I have posted this strategy before on other threads, and for the most part it works simply because I have more ways to win than to lose AND one can actually reduce the probability of winning a hard 10/4 to 1 in 3 as opposed to 35 to 1, and the hard 6/8 to 1 in 5 instead of 35 to 1. I use the doey/don't for starters: 4/10 point = $30 Don't odds (lay) + $7 hardways bet. A soft 4/10 loses you $37, i.e., two ways to lose; a 7 out give you an $8 net win; a hard 4/10 gives you a $19 net win plus you can come down with the bet. Total of seven ways to win something and only two ways to lose. One has a 3 1/2 to one probability of winning over the house and you have now reduced the hardway winner to a 1 in 3 chance of success. The 6/8 are pretty much the same with seven chances to win something and only four ways to lose and reducing the hard 6/8 to a one in five chance of winning. When the table is cold or choppy, this play can reap some reasonable rewards w/o a huge investment. falcon
Skulker, my hero! I had a customer (haven't seen him in years, might be DOA) that would start if the point was even, with $25 & $5, player control, pressing his and parleying ours if it hit.We caught a quintuple for 2K once, but hit 2X a lot. My fave prop bet parley is a $1 one roll seven, let the $5 ride if it hits and lock up $25 if seven rolls back to back.
'Twas not always so. :down: I'm going to regret posting this link, I just know it, but then I regret a lot of things I've done. Perhaps this will spawn a new forum subcategory: The Confessional. :smirk: http://midnightskulker.casinocitytimes.com/article/confessions-of-a-beginning-craps-player-1456
Well my friend at least you figured out EVENTUALLY why Frankie was so down in the mouth!! LMAO! Skulker, gaining wisdom is not a process that you can rush, no matter how intelligent you start out.
************** Hopping the Hardways! JHPA... After plowing through this topic after a long hiatus, I read your later comment after reading a lot of potato farming dice control techniques for hitting the hardways and border line theoretical game plans. Very interesting and... imaginative statement, indeed! I had never thought of pulling something like this off, but for myself, a Hardway "chronic" bettor, you add a new dimension to make MY game a bit more interesting. It is very logical, to me, and has some merit to test out on a table next time I am pressed up against a table. (My Hit and Run inside conservative game plan, earlier posted.) I remember seeing point being made Hard and front line winner made the Hardway. Not often enough, but I MAKE my biggest profits milking the hardways when they are coming up, way beyond statistical norms. It is still a long shot, but within my range of tolerance. Sometimes when you least expect it, someone comes up with some new twist to a game that actually makes sense AND is not part of a magical circus or metaphysical die experience that tires me of reading much further than the second post to a new topic. It shows that I do get off of my toadstool and can pick up a new trick to liven up a table! Thank you. You made my day more interesting!
When I have doubled my buy-in, I will throw down hard ways at $5 each. I parlay the 1st hit and double the remaining. I take the payout on the 3rd hit, leaving the base bet. If I miss a hardway, I start that number back at $5. I'll chase a hardway no more than 3 times. My most recent was at New Orleans Boomtown. Bought in for $400, left with $1900.
No. Since I only do hardways when I have doubled my buy-in, I don't feel a need for a hedge. Also, I prefer to make pass line and come bets, so at that point, I'm usually on 4 or 5 points. For me, come bets leave me less exposed if I have an early 7-out.
Hi preacher you buy in for 400 you double that is the total 800 or 800 plus your original buy in of 400 just asking
I have a math question for siik2nr regarding his $5 hardway two hit parlay.. Say if you put $5 on the hard 6 or 8 and you hit once and then you parley it ,,,how do you come up with $405? 5 x 9 = $45 + $5 that you first put up = $50 x 9 = $450 not $405. Same on the hard 4 and 10 but x 7 obviously. You have to add your original $5 if you are "parlaying" it... If I missed someone else asking about this I apologize. I have a 1hop-split-2hitparlay-withthe6or8 "strategy or system" or whatever the craps world would like to call it, that I have just add to my craps game. I can explain it if anyone is interested in it.
Yeah, man, go ahead and explain it, we're always "open" to new strategies, or new twists on old ones. [/QUOTE] one more thing, you responded to a post that is almost 7 years old, so you may not get the answer to the question. Could have been a typo, or, a brain fart, and possibly, incompetence, a common "virtue" around here. Let's have that strategy, Man.
Something here to consider for the 6 & 8 player Spice up the game for more profits , The center of the table is where the big money is , proceed with caution however BET WHAT THE DICE ARE GIVING YOU
My problem with this advice is that I do not see it as a given that just because one or two hard ways have shown, that there will be more to follow. Now the guy whom random roller and I were next to at the table on Saturday had no problem betting/pressing what the dice were giving him. Hence, we referred to him as "James". RR astutely observed that this guy knew how to take what the dice were giving him, and he followed suit to get himself across, although not as quickly or as aggressively as James, who was collecting big from both place bets and HW's. I did pretty well on the long shooter with just a single come bet, hitting 4 or 5, but I did see a situation where I'd have been better off on the place bet. Of course I understand how this works, but no, I am not going to become a place bettor. There are advantages and disadvantages with each play.
