Fire bet

Discussion in 'Prop Bets & Side Bets' started by acer, Feb 24, 2009.

  1. Greatest 7 Shooter in the World, Aug 24, 2011

    Greatest 7 Shooter in the World

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    its just like betting a 30-1 longshot at the track. When they turn for home and your longshot is in the 3rd position on the outside and making a move you will be living. Problem is you might get one every 6 months or more.

    I do however love the idea of the laybet when u are up. 1 it shows that you are all about the money and not "glory". It probably kills the pitboss a little inside when you do this. ahahah
     
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  2. eagledice, Aug 24, 2011

    eagledice

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    I agree with you on the longshot example for the "rush" of the bet. But, Personally if I am the shooter I just can't get into the Lay bet as it bums me out and mentally it tells me that the run is over and I am never making the final point.

    Now I have to admit that I have never had money on a firebet for another shooter thats made 5 and set the 6th point. I imagine it that happens in the future I my lean towards that bet option. Of course in realtime playing it happens so fast that I may not even remember what to do to properly set the lay and the main issue is for me in setting the lay to not disturb the shooter and throw him off his game. Nothing would be worse than my lay bet holding up the game and the shooter sevens out........

    But just my thoughts...

    Eagledice
     
    #22
  3. COPENNY2, Aug 24, 2011

    COPENNY2

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    I appreciate the reply to my post. Believe me when I say that you're not raining on my parade at all. I worked at Harrah's Casino in New Orleans for over 5 years on the graveyard shift. I saw a lot in that time. Xmas eve and people come in and lose their whole paychecks and are just walking around the casino afterwards because their too scared to go home and admit what they've done. I've also seen a homeless woman walk in with $20 that someone gave her and she put it into a Sizzlin' 7 machine and in 3 pulls hit it for $1000. Not once. Not twice. But 3 times. We had to do 8 hopper fills on that machine while she was there. That was when they still used actual coins in the machines instead of printing the tickets. I've seen gamblers trying to jump over different table games trying to hit the dealer because they lost a big hand and it was their last bet. I'm a realist. When I walk in the door of a casino, whatever money I have to gamble with I've learned to consider it lost as soon as I take my first step inside the door. But it sure does feel good to walk out with more than I went in with. Even if it's just a dollar. LOL.
     
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  4. Greatest 7 Shooter in the World, Aug 25, 2011

    Greatest 7 Shooter in the World

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    Eagle,
    I believe you think this way because you enjoy playing craps and love the thrill. And if you win great but if you loose its the price of the entertainment. Now if you ever decide to look at craps as a business standpoint then you are forced to throw away all "Feelings", "Hunches", and get ready to disapoint the entire table. Because at the end of the night you will be in 3 brackets.

    1. The guy coloring up at the end of the table and laughing at the boxman while he colors up your chips......

    2. The guy who was up or down and ended up even and gets to give it another shot the next day....

    3. Or the guy who has a million stories on how he shoulda coulda and woulda if this or that happened and he is the guy who is walking around the casino trying to talk to anyone who will listen to him on how
    bad his luck is.

    About a year and half ago I made the decision to treat craps like i would every other business deal I am in and I am never looking back. Yeah i would love to all night long shoot for firebets, hardways, Yo's, and
    max all my odds bets but I know my chance of winning is less than 10%. And anyone who thinks they can bet like this and beat the house all night will find themselves in bracket #3.
     
    #24
  5. eagledice, Aug 25, 2011

    eagledice

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    You make very good points. I will step back a bit and next time at the tables and take the "rush" out of the play and start thinking of this as more business than pleasure.

    Thanks

    Eagledice
     
    #25
  6. livediecraps, Aug 25, 2011

    livediecraps

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    AMEN!
     
    #26
  7. Greatest 7 Shooter in the World, Aug 25, 2011

    Greatest 7 Shooter in the World

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    I had a similar situation in Nassau BH last year. It was my turn to shoot and I had the follwing bets up on the come out.

    lay the 4 for $410 and a $50 dont pass bet. my point was a 8

    first roll after my point I put a buy bet 5 $100, 6 $110, 9 $100 and lay bet remains up.

    first roll is hard 6 which i am not on so I win 1 unit on the 6.
    second roll hard 10 which i am not on and do not win or loose anything
    third roll is a 5 and I winl 1.4 units

    At this point there is a drunk guy who won on both hard way bets and the 5. He is cheering for me like we were best friends.

    4th roll I take down my 5, 6, and 9 bets and down my lay the 4 bet to 200 (which is house money). I roll another 5. did not win or lose anything

    5th roll 7 out. I short armed it and planted both dice just short of the wall for a classic 3-4. When the drunk saw them paying me out for the lay bet and the dont pass he just lost it.

    He was yelling "you shot that 7 on purpose" F-u F-this F-that. He was almost going to swing at me before some extra security guards came over.

    So for my roll I was up 3.9 units and perfectly happy. Did everyone at the table hate me YES. Did everyone at the table loose except me Yes. But its all business its me against the house not against the individual players. And I am going to take the edge that i usually throw the dice around 3-4 times and 7 out. I have not tried to change the way I play i just adapted my betting strat and bankroll management to my strengths and weaknesses when I shoot the dice. Like I said its all business.
     
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  8. Southern-Comfort, Aug 25, 2011

    Southern-Comfort

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    [quote author="Greatest 7 Shooter in the World" date="1314318712"]

    He was yelling "you shot that 7 on purpose"quote]

    My response would have been "If I had that kind of control I'd be betting hardways and still rolling."
    And I would be betting hardways and still rolling.
     
    #28
  9. $nakeEye$, Aug 26, 2011

    $nakeEye$

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    [quote author="Greatest 7 Shooter in the World" date="1314318712"]I had a similar situation in Nassau BH last year. It was my turn to shoot and I had the follwing bets up on the come out.

    lay the 4 for $410 and a $50 dont pass bet. my point was a 8

    first roll after my point I put a buy bet 5 $100, 6 $110, 9 $100 and lay bet remains up.

    first roll is hard 6 which i am not on so I win 1 unit on the 6.
    second roll hard 10 which i am not on and do not win or loose anything
    third roll is a 5 and I winl 1.4 units

    At this point there is a drunk guy who won on both hard way bets and the 5. He is cheering for me like we were best friends.

    4th roll I take down my 5, 6, and 9 bets and down my lay the 4 bet to 200 (which is house money). I roll another 5. did not win or lose anything

    5th roll 7 out. I short armed it and planted both dice just short of the wall for a classic 3-4. When the drunk saw them paying me out for the lay bet and the dont pass he just lost it.

    He was yelling "you shot that 7 on purpose" F-u F-this F-that. He was almost going to swing at me before some extra security guards came over.

    So for my roll I was up 3.9 units and perfectly happy. Did everyone at the table hate me YES. Did everyone at the table loose except me Yes. But its all business its me against the house not against the individual players. And I am going to take the edge that i usually throw the dice around 3-4 times and 7 out. I have not tried to change the way I play i just adapted my betting strat and bankroll management to my strengths and weaknesses when I shoot the dice. Like I said its all business.[/quote]

    Why is the above, in quotations , reminiscint of what Clint said a few years ago - " A man has to know his limitations " -

    Amen, Brother -
     
    #29
  10. ComeBet, Sep 7, 2011

    ComeBet

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    Does anyone know the true house advantage on the Fire Bet?

    Is it approaching the 10% mark or is it closer to a Placebet on the 10?

    Thanks,
     
    #30
  11. The Midnight Skulker, Sep 7, 2011

    The Midnight Skulker

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    The Wizard of Odds gives it as 24.7%! Of course that depends on the pay table. I think the one he used was 2000:1 for all six points. In any event, luck happens, but the house has the players as a group by whatever the players don't want the house to have them by.
     
    #31
  12. PokerPlayer, Sep 18, 2011

    PokerPlayer

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    When you consider the large house advantage plus, you have to pay tax on 300:1 wins, it makes the fire bet the worst bet you can make on the craps table by a large margin. Never make a fire bet. Ever.
     
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  13. ComeBet, Sep 19, 2011

    ComeBet

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    While a terrible bet, I disagree. The worst bet i've ever seen on a crap table is [BIG 6/BIG 8], those are by far the worst bests I've ever seen.
     
    #33
  14. TwinStix, Sep 19, 2011

    TwinStix

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    hard not to throw a check or two at the fire when you've hit a six-pointer before....

    bad bet or not....just sayin...

    In reality....every bet is bad when you're immediately at a statistical disadvantage as soon as your chips hit the felt.


    Play craps for fun, knuckleheads, and stop trying to make a living....
     
    #34
  15. The Midnight Skulker, Sep 21, 2011

    The Midnight Skulker

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    I heartily agree simply because there is another bet available that wins and loses under the exact same conditions as the corner red bets, but pays better than even money. I refer of course to the place bets on those numbers.
     
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  16. $nakeEye$, Sep 22, 2011

    $nakeEye$

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    Regarding the " FireBet" -

    I find it to be an intersting and potentially lucrative " SideBet " -

    Much more potentially profitable than some of the asinine " crazy crapper " proposition bets on the table -

    As far as the " ODDS " of this bet -

    Who gives a flying f*ck -

    If you have a " shooter " -

    You have a good chance of winning a few or many bucks -

    When you have the " Shake, Rattle and Rollers " -

    Anything is possible - Although I would not bet the farm on these schmucks -

    Last Saturday evening a fellow at SL1 from Brooklyn hit 5 numbers -

    Multiple repeats I might add -

    A few rounds after I hit 4 also with multiple repeats -

    Unfortunately, I was not betting on his roll - he did - his $5 bet returned $2,500-

    My pissy $3 bet returned $75 -

    Say what you may about the " FireBet " -

    I am a believer and a bettor when it comes to this bet -

    By the way - Ceaser's AC is getting the FireBet on their layoutin the very near future -

    Ceaser's AC has 11 twelve foot craps tables !
     
    #36
  17. ComeBet, Sep 22, 2011

    ComeBet

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    I see your point, but Im not one to go outside the low casino advantage plays. I avoid everything that gives a higher house advantage then the place bets of 6&8.

    I once added place bets of 5 & 9 to my common level of play but found my bank roll was being depleted even faster then I anticipated. by a factor of 2x.

    For me it's a dollar, agreed. But i Can toke the dealers and I might If I see the bet put a two way bet on it for both myself and the dealers, but past that the efficency lost is rather large.
     
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  18. $nakeEye$, Sep 23, 2011

    $nakeEye$

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    Personally, I do not toke the dealers -

    They have no influence over the outcome of my toss one way or the other -

    I realize that they might make less than minimun wage -

    But on the other hand - they have a job - and it is by their choice that they elected to whore themselves to the casinos -

    IF I have a winning episode at the tables and IF I elect to throw them a few extra dollars that I won -

    I will gladly give it to them --

    I am under no obligation to sustain their living standard -

    If the casinos were so concerned -

    Let them ensure the welfare of their employees -

    I am a businessman and I have employees that count on me for their livelyhood -

    I meet and endeavour to exceed my obligations to my people -

    The casinos' obligation to their employees is their concern - NOT MINE -

    F*CK THEM !!!!!!!!!

    I will tip the cocktail waitress who brings me free drinks with the casino's intent to make make me " loose and/or at ease " in order for them to liberate my money from me to put into their chip stacks -

    I was not born yesterday -

    As usual I have gotten off the topic of conversation -

    I apologize !
     
    #38
  19. $nakeEye$, Sep 23, 2011

    $nakeEye$

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    I have " sex " for fun -

    I go to the casino to take their money - it's a job - not fun - it's strictly business - nothing personal !
     
    #39
  20. The Midnight Skulker, Sep 28, 2011

    The Midnight Skulker

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    How is the (rewardable) service of the cocktail waitress different from the (not rewardable) service of the dealers? Not trying to start a fight here, but this seems inconsistent as neither of these service providers have any direct effect on your profit/loss.
     
    #40