That chart doesn't mean " Jack Shit" to shooters of Jame's caliber. James Pre-post reply: My GAWD...Why are you guys so obsessed with me? Can't go one fu**kin post without my name coming out of your mouths! LTWOQ

All pun aside. This chart is an awesome and useful tool for anyone learning to master the game of craps. The Dice tracking chart Many other outcomes arise from simply finding what your primary numbers are and then later adjusting those numbers to suite what numbers you need to roll in order to complete the Small/All/Tall/Fire bet. Simple dice chart. As shown above. It's good to know. It works!!!

We want to see the results pyramid for DI's. Give us your last 500 rolls. It will be very close to above chart. You seriously skew the 4 and 10 let me know when/where you'll be shooting next.

Did not mean to hijack the thread. Yes it's important for new players to understand the chart above. It should be studied by every player.

I have a better chart than that in my book ( pg 19). It shows...dice total...possible combinations ( pictures of dice with each possible combination)....# of ways to roll the number....the odds of rolling the number. In addition,on page 180, I have a homework assignment ; pg 180 contains a blank chart with 144 squares....you are to toss the dice 144 times ( 4 groups of 36 ) and write down in each square each point number tossed. ; the idea is to compare your results with the normal predicted frequency distribution...you record your results for how many times each of 11 numbers have been rolled in 144 tosses; another chart on pg 181 shows you how many times each number 'should' have rolled ; you tally how many times each number has been rolled and write that total in the chart ; you compare actual results with predicted results. To determine your average, add all 144 numbers rolled in chart on pg 180 and divide by 144; if your average is above 7, this indicates that you rolled more high value points than low value points. The point of the exercise is to show that the math pretty much holds RE: frequency distribution and the fact that , over time, the numbers really are DUE. ( I'm just kidding on the last part of this sentence and would never teach Due theory to students ) . This exercise , of comparing predicted verses actual, is only one of several I ask people to do. Then you get to take a 100 question final exam.( also in the book, with answers) 777

curious what the chart looks like and if it's better than mine? I also use many of these charts to determine Fire bet numbers using customized "Primary dice number set" Also good for Small/Tall/All bets

Yours is better. Mine just has 3 headings across the top.........Point. ( Below Point it shows numbers 2 thru 12).........Predicted Number........Actual Number. 777

A better chart that considers the fact that dice are three-dimensional objects and which shows all possible permutations of the dice is a "multiple of 16 variant" of your "Table of 36." The reason it is better is that it verifies the fact that some dice outcomes are considerably safer than other dice outcomes. Now in reality, because what shows on top pays all the bills in the game of craps, some might say that this idea of safety is a bit overblown. As a matter of opinion, I would not say that, and in fact I have concluded that IF a shooter can find a way bring about the highest possible preponderance of these safer dice outcomes, he is likely to have better success at the game than a dice chucker. Good God, have I become a so-called DI? No, I am just recognizing a feature present in the dice that MIGHT be used to my advantage. I have concluded that it does not hurt to observe dice outcomes of every shooter, and at times will put out an "extra" bet when I see a safe shooter. However, I think that this information is probably best used with the dice in my own hands (make that hand, as they do not like the plural), and I do not even consider myself a "good" shooter.

So, Koko....in essence you are saying that ( in your opinion) Dice Speak is more effective in the hands of a Di as opposed to a Random Roller? A Di SHOULD be able to toss more Group 2 outings than a Random Roller?

Yes, from the point of view that "influencing" a group outcome is a hell of a lot easier than sniping a number. There are only two groups, and because there are actually a lot more safe outcomes than unsafe ones, any shooter has better than a 50:50 chance to end safely. But as you and I know, there are times when a "safe" outcome will be the seven, and the hand will end. Because our tossing truly is random no matter how good things look, I never thought that the term "influence" is the right term to apply to shooting dice.

Koko I think that is hardest for people to understand is that anything can happen in either group . My playing partner has trouble with that and will until he is dead.. He was trained by GTC into thinking all that counts is how many hard ways you get. I don't want to have my dice land in a hardway set... to many bad things can happen on average, however all hardways can happen in other situations like a 3v set . Influence as you stated is different in that to some that implies control... then you get back to a discussion of dice control and you know where that goes. tdb

If you wouldn't teach due theory to students, then why do you tout it here on the forum? What did you score on the exam?

I wrote the exam dummy.....I got an 80%.... I think it makes sense even though the math does not support it.....I can state facts and I can state my opinion....as long as I keep it separate, people can decide which way to swing. In many past posts on the subject, here and on other boards, I have often stated the math does not support Due Theory, as I give arguments to the contrary. Just cause you have the facts, doesn't mean you are right. 777