DI 's who need to step it up

Discussion in 'Dice Influencing' started by Dave G Ct, Nov 2, 2016.

  1. DeMango, Nov 5, 2016

    DeMango

    DeMango Member

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    Hey Neanderthal! Who started this here thread? You did looking for attention, being the attention whore you are. Talk about pot, kettle, black. How about a healthy dose of shut the fuck up??? $5 betters who only play in one casino or two are obviously SRT's, cause if they were a threat to the casino, they would be tossed a long time ago. Especially Indian casinos, a law unto themselves.
     
    #101
  2. betwthelines, Nov 5, 2016

    betwthelines

    betwthelines Member

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    yes, i understand that.

    i am "not sure" truly whether i agree with it or not however...my perception is that there are some on here that are very much trying to convince others of the efficacy of DI...but, really: no matter my take, it is really not that big of a deal one way or another...

    everyone here perceives things differently and can make up their own minds on the issue even though, frankly, i do not think that it is much of an issue at all..
    i doubt very much that tdv has changed his name...ever...
    the mistake is yours...no, i do not "see that"...not at all...not at all...tdv, for example, has FREQUENTLY expressed the opposite of animosity, by acknowledging the FUN DIers have to which he is perfectly ok, congratulating them upon wins and wishing them well...

    you pick up on a few phrases and words of disagreement and IGNORE the rest...some might be---frankly i can't think of any---trying to run peoples off this forum but it is not tdv...now it is true that he has mentioned that you were "run off" another board, something that i myself saw no need for...more likely---correct me if i am wrong---you ran yourself off over no buy-in there as to your views rather than any formal "banishment" from the place...

    this is stuff you are making up in your own head...my opinion is that you are wrong and, further, the irony here is that you make some good points and DO NOT NEED to mis-attribute things to others, which only suggest that you have no valid argument other than characterizations of the others' person...
    ok...these are fair points...let's look at this point by point..
    first of all i certainly hope that tdv never called you "stupid" and if he has i would take him to task for it...although he might have said that what you are doing is stupid if you spend all of those hours practicing and yet apparently are still a lifetime loser (ok, setting aside your results prior to practicing DI, is that true? tdv seems to want to make much of that...frankly i am unclear that you ever said that but he certainly thinks that you did...did you? or rather, more importantly, are you?...be honest now)...but i do know that he also said that if you are having FUN with it, so be it...good on yah...

    as for "recording the data correctly"...well...frankly by the 'standard' srr method you are not recording the data "correctly"...but so what?...tdv seems to be q;uite bothered by this...but let it be his problem...BOTH 'pilot and i have defended your method as legitimate depending upon what it is that you are looking for...now, true, if you "go public" with some type of srr number claim there are going to be some issues...further discussion however could clarify those issues...

    ok...look...i know that you do not want to hear about it (lol) but the bohunk challenge perfectly accommodates any concerns in this area as the shooter is in complete control of which rolls "count"... can call "off'", for example, come out rolls or any rolls where one might be setting for, for example, a 7...
    yes, it makes perfect sense.

    but as i have said repeatedly, if you are going to put forth these ideas on a public forum, it is simply something that you must endure, must expect, must put up with...or leave, something neither i-certainly- and-probably-tdv too wishes.

    neither tdv nor i nor many others could give one shit about DI techniques or theories or mechanics...i know zero, nor care to know, about such things, skimming or ignoring the many words about such on here...but this is no way precludes me nor anyone to put forth opinions about anecdotal claims or any claims regarding OUTCOMES or RESULTS...

    some of us have just witnessed way too many craps dice rolls, have been in the presence way too many shooters claiming influence or skill, seen how the house deals with these shooters vs, say, card counters and just might have some strong opinions on the matter...

    contrary opinions are GUARANTEED on a public craps forum.
    true dat

    ------------------------------------------------​

    obviously i do not speak for tdv nor has it been my intention here to defend him, which he is perfectly capable of doing himself, but rather to make clear that the way in which -->I<--perceive his postings differs from the way that you see them.

    tom p
     
    #102
  3. betwthelines, Nov 5, 2016

    betwthelines

    betwthelines Member

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    only very, very rarely would this libertarian want to ban anyone and think that jacob does a damn good job in this area...

    however i agree with the long island man here...problem is the practicality of the matter...tracking down sock puppets would be time-consuming, for one, but mainly its accuracy and reliablility would be difficult to manage...camoflaging IPs is simply not that difficult for anyone serious about disguise.

    jacob can correct me if i am wrong.

    tom p
     
    #103
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  4. Dave G Ct, Nov 5, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    DeMango
    Gargoil agrees with me about the irrelevance of casino roll tracking and changing sets.People who are net positive are never SRT' s.I put this thread up because you do have to step up your game. You did not see Gargoil' s name there.Give Bone Tracker a great- maybe useful when you began your journey but time to stand on your own two feet.Get rid of the training wheels!!!!
     
    #104
  5. Dave G Ct, Nov 5, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Give bone tracker a rest
     
    #105
  6. betwthelines, Nov 5, 2016

    betwthelines

    betwthelines Member

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    well, of course that is true, much to the glee of james hall and sometimes the chagrin of tdb...lol...

    OTOH for the vast, vast majority of readers no response is deemed necessary...again using just your examples in james hall's case his BS is so transparent that no response is needed...anyone thinking even half-critically might easily refrain from piling on...his hole has already been dug clear to china...

    as for tdb...well...frankly i like the guy, like his family values, like his fishing expertise etc...but he can be...um...confusing sometimes...my tendency---kind of a general one for me but in tdb's case quite better than average common---is to break down each clause and respond in that matter...

    so what is my point with this post? -- i have no frickin' idea...

    tom p
    -g. geist: i think it is just to get in another backhand at james hall
    --tom p: pretty easy, huh?
    ---g. geist: yah
    ----tom p: but...aww...come on...give me a little more credit than that motive
    -----g. geist: nope
     
    #106
  7. Dave G Ct, Nov 5, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Betwnthelines
    Since baseball has ended you have too much time on your hands!
     
    #107
  8. Onautopilot, Nov 5, 2016

    Onautopilot

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    I have no argument with you concerning your own perception of the data you collect, or how you use it.

    I was just stating my opinion that anyone with an 8+ SRR has the keys to the vault. And that I doubted that anyone was consistently opening that vault with those claimed skills.

    If one had an SRR of 8+, they would have over a 15% advantage over the casino, using several different betting strategies. That is a HUGE advantage, and highly exploitable.

    I know if I had that advantage, I would not be on here talking about it....I would be building my bankroll, quietly, and alone!
     
    #108
  9. betwthelines, Nov 5, 2016

    betwthelines

    betwthelines Member

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    garg, i very much like your measured (and civil) replies...seems you join ttop in that camp, especially regarding what is or may be possible with DI...hope you stick around more often...

    do not agree completely with them of course...am more or less with tdv on this stuff...why, shit, OF COURSE it is "opinion"...do not believe there has been a claim otherwise although i agree with tdv that there are facts behind them...it is simply true that there is no "black book" of banned craps players, a very telling fact...

    forty-three years (in my case) at commercial bank craps rails without ever once perceiving anything other than a random roll by anyone, including claimants of skill (with some ratification by slo-mo videos as well) does play in a long ways as to one's opinion regarding the efficacy of DI...

    we all agree on some things too...IF there is someone either making a living or a large contribution to their life-style shooting craps, we are not seeing anything about it on a public forum...

    there is, certainly in theory, but also IMO in reality, a very tiny few that are still making that living card counting in bj...true, this is becoming more and more difficult as the casinos take countermeasures...these would be very clever at disguising their play (if not themselves...lol) and employ uncommon diversity in their venues...quite, quite obviously those tiny few are not saying anything about it onna public forum!!

    but even with near-perfect play that bj skill advantage is extremely thin, thinner even than some DIers claim, yet that advantage is sufficient to make that living or dramatically affect that enhanced life-style with the right management of the advantage...it takes nothing more than a kelly-like betting strategem and extraordinary discipline.

    good luck

    tom p
     
    #109
  10. Dave G Ct, Nov 5, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Being thrown out for winning? DeMango again showing the consequences of legalised drugs.My Shift Supervisor friend told me of private games there where a high roller may win a million or lose one.Now they are going to get upset when a regular wins a few hundred?
    You ever notice how these amateurs are able to make decisions for the casino reserved for the top management.They play and think they know the industry where in reality should spend time stepping up their game.
     
    #110
  11. betwthelines, Nov 5, 2016

    betwthelines

    betwthelines Member

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    um...no.

    the bc pays 7 to 1 for a (true) srr of 7 or better, 500 rolls

    for 6 or 8/36rolls the 500 roll payout is 12 to 1.

    the srr challenge is much easier to beat than the 6/36

    complete details are on post #71 of the bohunk challenge thread.

    as stated from the get-go, any other numbers or claims would be entertained , awaiting only a proposition or claim & payouts could be attached to it...

    tom p
     
    #111
  12. TDVegas, Nov 5, 2016

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    As was stated by you....this quote below has nothing to do with "making up for 38 years" as it relates to the efficacy of DI. Your words---"No DI (your word "you" as in calling other DI) can expect to be a lifetime winner." How the hell would you know how many years they played as a non DI? Or if they lost?
    Nope, this is a blanket statement on your feelings about long term DI play. DIRECT AND TO THE POINT. Don't try and squirrel around it by NOW adding "my first 38 years"...because when you say "it won't make you a lifetime winner"...that statement stands on its own for all DI and your opinion....not just yourself.

    "It won't make YOU a lifetime winner"...again, you have no idea how long "YOU" (as in "others") played as a non DI and lost and now they can "make up that time" (and money) by now being a DI.

    Your problem is you think we here are dummies and just "misinterpreted" your statement and now you can twist it to mean something else. Nope. Sorry. That shit doesn't fly here.

    James Hall has tried that approach many times and has been called out for..well...some significant contradictions of previous statements. Dont make the same mistake he has.

    And I am not calling anyone a fraud. I am just noting your seeming contradictions where you are now pulling a "James Hall"....and trying to re-write history.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 5, 2016
  13. The Comeback Kid, Nov 5, 2016

    The Comeback Kid

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    Mind if I "butt" in? Don't answer that.
    Any way you look at it, what you want to do is CONTROL your INFLUENCE.
    Mermer, mermer...what does he mean?

    Awareness is influence. Focus is influence. Your mindfulness floods energy toward that which you give attention to. The problem is our attention is all over the place. Thus, we attract a scattered experience – both wanted & unwanted. You’re too smart for your own good. You’ve looked at it backwards & forwards, analyzed it to death; trained yourself well to consider all contingencies, pros & the cons, plusses & minuses. Now it’s a self-induced prison & you my friend are toast.

    Thus your mind is over-influencing everything at once & you rightfully call it random or chaos or that which is without control/influence. But occasionally, yes there are those moments, when the light shines though, and your desire finds a crack of least resistance. But, wouldn’t it be just dandy if you could get control of your influence (or influence your control) and not have to rely on fate? The trick is to find a way to focus pure - without contradiction. Therein lies the key.

    Get your influence under control. Effective happy people are those that know what they want (& what they don’t want). They're focused on their intentions; current reality means diddly squat. They believe it, they’ve practiced it, and the results surprise & delight. They’re innovators; not imitators. Contrast that with those that hope & speculate. Mediocrity - not so fun.

    Question; Is your experience coming at you, or is it coming through you?

    Every NOW is ripe with infinite potential, yet we continually create the same damn thing over & over. Different places;different faces - essence the same. Only you can save yourself. You must unlearn, but you can’t - really. The grooves are too thick & deep, and they take you right in. So your only option then is to make new grooves…Let go of what you've learned & like a dog on a bone, re-learn, realign, and get control of your influence!

    tumblr_mg63ahyqvH1rivg1lo1_1280.jpg
     
    #113
  14. Dave G Ct, Nov 5, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Riding the energy beam- love to see it!
     
    #114
  15. TDVegas, Nov 5, 2016

    TDVegas

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    LOL....I try, Dave. I try.
     
    #115
  16. The Midnight Skulker, Nov 5, 2016

    The Midnight Skulker

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    I call mine the Power Roll, which I employ to encourage the owners of hands left in the line of fire to withdraw them. Too bad the dice have to come to rest on the table to be called, eh? Otherwise we could defeat the pyramids by embedding the dice in them.
    You can't be serious! How do you know that what you are doing to influence the dice is actually having any influence? Craps is not a sport (e.g. golf, tennis, bowling, tiddlywinks), where the effect of random chance can easily be shown to be at most negligible. (OK, tiddlywinks isn't a sport, but it is a skill-intensive activity.) Hence the only way to show influence is by comparing actual results to theoretical ones. Where do you think the theoretical results come from?
    Nevertheless, by stating that you are a DI you are implying that there is such a thing as DI, and I reiterate that I feel somewhat obligated to point out that your claim is an unsupported opinion. In so doing I am not impugning the claimant's (your) honesty, merely the basis for his/her/your conclusion. "Caveat lector," basically.
    At the risk of picking a nit I must point out that this sounds a bit mathematical. ;)
    I have been considering using a similar strategy, only alternating take-press beginning with the first hit with no regression down. Not as aggressive, but then I'm only a DI wannabe.
     
    #116
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  17. gargoil, Nov 5, 2016

    gargoil

    gargoil Member

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    Midnight, as hard as it is to believe, yes I don't believe in the Math of the game and I don't need it to know I am influencing the dice. To me the Math, tracking rolls, etc.. they are all distractions of what you should be doing and that is influencing yourself to know that you can influence the dice. DI is not about practicing to roll a certain number then going to the casino and betting that number. DI is about throwing the dice in a certain fashion to reduce the seven. And making minor modifications on that same throw on a different table in a different casino for the same result.

    I track how I throw, what set I used, Most 2 numbers thrown for every casino I play in and every table in that casino I played at. I record the serial number of the table. How do I know most numbers thrown if I don't track rolls? simple. I ALWAYS bet the same way and the final dollar amount wagered on the place bets when the seven shows lets me know which two hit the most.

    I don't care that the math says a seven will appear 1 in 6 rolls etc. My confidence in my dice influence changes that. I don't care what that number changes to (1 in 8, 1 in 9, etc.). Just knowing that I can change it makes me bet the game aggressively to take advantage of that. Again this is my play and how I play. Everyone else may think it's crazy, stupid, self absorbed claims, lies, etc. I don't care. It works for me and that's all that matters in the end.

    By the way I think you should play your alternative press betting. Sure it's not as aggressive but it has potential for a good payout on a descent roll. You should try it and let us know.
     
    #117
  18. TDVegas, Nov 5, 2016

    TDVegas

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    In the middle of calling out numbers and wagers....you're suggesting if I track your 36 roll set you will know how many of each 4-5-6-8-9-10 and 7's you will roll simply based on your cash out? Ever have anyone tell you a phone number and then the guy next to him is saying different numbers? Good luck remembering or recalling.

    So, if you hit two numbers (wins)...7 out...then start over....progress or regress....you think you can now reverse engineer all the incoming (wins) or outgoing (losses) and figure out what numbers rolled?

    You started with $200.....left with $425. You're telling me based on that you will know the exact count of what sequence of numbers (how many of each) rolled with the ONLY basis being cash in/cash out?---also considering your wagers are not stagnant---they change.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 5, 2016
  19. gargoil, Nov 5, 2016

    gargoil

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    Following your advice.
     
    #119
  20. The Midnight Skulker, Nov 5, 2016

    The Midnight Skulker

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    Back on the old Usenet newsgroup -- sorry, I lack the interest to try to find the thread -- someone posted they had hit some number of one or more point numbers during a hand. A dealer (Heather, for the refugees) expressed incredulity that someone would actually count hits by box number during a hand. I responded that I could do so without actually counting using the same technique you just described: my final (losing) bet would tell me how many wins I had had.
    I prefer a straight winning progression to a regression, and the alternating take-press (BTW that's a power press: 10/12→25, etc.) seems like a good compromise. Same bet after first hit guarantees a profit for the series, and you can still make some good bank on a hand.
     
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