DI 's who need to step it up

Discussion in 'Dice Influencing' started by Dave G Ct, Nov 2, 2016.

  1. Dave G Ct, Nov 2, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Well I can think of two right off the bat.LID who does have a lot of talent has been skating by with posirive play from his other games.Needs to get back with a great hand- no doubt that it will come.
    As to DeMango well that is another story.Since he has questionable locked down talent his game is in a constant flux.He does know the game so no problem there.His confidence needs a boost- perhaps he can have a 24 carat hand AND stick with that approach meaning Dice set and execution.The verdict is still out.
     
    #1
  2. Dave G Ct, Nov 2, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Questionable talent
     
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  3. twodicebilly, Nov 2, 2016

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    Dave G ct


    I swear, It is bad enough to have to put up with 14,000
    posts from two guys that like to only see their names on
    here.....now your nonsense...

    My question is simple.. do you or anyone else on here
    have any idea how dice influence really works in the
    real world.

    here are a couple questions you should answer before you
    question others.

    1...what affect does the table have on set
    2...what affect do personal physical change have on outcome
    3 what does access control mean
    4 what does off axis control mean
    5 what is the relationship between starting set and finish
    6...what is the relationship between bad dice and the seven showing
    7 what is the relationship between craps numbers and the 6-1
    8 can a change in starting set be charted
    9 can set change over come bad dice
    10..can starting set change SRR

    These are just a few of the items you should understand before
    you question others. Certainly TDV and Autoguy would not have
    a clue so they just say " it does not mean anything"

    That works for them, but it should work for anyone that wants
    to be taken seriously.

    twodicebilly
     
    #3
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  4. KokomoJoe4, Nov 2, 2016

    KokomoJoe4

    KokomoJoe4 Member

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    Unless Dave has played regularly with LID or DeMango (which I am pretty sure he has not), HOW can he possibly make a comment about talent?

    Is this from his analysis of what they say/have said on this board? Anyone can talk a good game. Performing consistently is another matter, isn't it? LID and DM do not regularly toot their own horns, unlike others.



    On another note, TDB's question #5 rings a bell for me. Linaway's material allows you to analyze this information QUICKLY and CORRECTLY. You know exactly what is happening at the table as it happens.

    Unfortunately, because one result has no relationship to the next, the material does not amount to being golden information that can be used to rob the casino. Rather, it shows whether the shooter at hand is finishing in sevenphillic or sevenphobic outcomes.
     
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  5. Linaway, Nov 2, 2016

    Linaway

    Linaway Member

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    2dicebilly and kokomojoe4 has it wired. It's all about probability and variance. Simply put, if you don't know what your looking at under any circumstance, chances are you will lose.
     
    #5
  6. The Midnight Skulker, Nov 2, 2016

    The Midnight Skulker

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    :D:p:D
    Who needs SRRs, on-/off-axis, pitch, yaw (or is it "ya'all"?) when the above says it all (yaw/ya'all)? I hereby nominate Kokomojoe4 as the designated lexicographer of the forum.
     
    #6
  7. twodicebilly, Nov 2, 2016

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    [ Kokomojoe


    Nice post.....

    However.... one thing needs to be explained.....you indicated
    one roll has no relationship to another......

    that statement is not accurate. The fact that one throw has a
    relationship to another is the entire essence of what Linaway
    in getting to and indeed what successful dice influencing is
    all about.

    Now I understand if you listen to the nonsense of TDV and
    others they suggest you need to roll 10,00o rolls at home
    and then you can go to a casino and say I am going to throw
    a 6 and you throw a six......to them that is dice control

    pure hogwash......

    Being able to look at your results and make an adjustment
    is what it is all about.. the relationship of one roll to the next
    and then the next is what allows you to win more than an
    average player would....

    Dice influence is not about picking numbers, but about finding
    a starting set that allows you to avoid a seven more than random
    results suggest is possible..

    twodicebilly
     
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  8. KokomoJoe4, Nov 2, 2016

    KokomoJoe4

    KokomoJoe4 Member

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    This is also what I gathered about "attempting" to influence results. Although I have no belief in DI, I always set in a variation of the V6 or HW, and modify slightly when I don't like the result.

    I figure that since dice do not stay on-axis, you will be better off starting in one of the seven heavy axial arrays. This "should" make a "safer" outcome more likely.

    I have had some great shoots (but not enough of them). I have unfortunately also had plenty of shitty ones. :(
     
    #8
  9. TDVegas, Nov 2, 2016

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    LOL...with all the extra hours practicing, honing skills, having to wait for dice to come around and make no wagers during others rolling (possibly quadrupling your time at the table? vs a randie)...you still say you will be a net loser with DI.

    I can play a simple pass/odds and with a tiny bit of luck be...be net positive or close to even (unlike you) or lose some (like you) and I haven't wasted countless hours at the rail staring at the clock waiting for the dice. Hours practicing. Hours honing a "skill." Hours making adjustments. Money to buy a table. Etc.

    Worst of all--the hours spent on a table doing nothing but waiting and watching until the dice come around.

    Quite frankly, your version of DI is rather odd. You STILL expect to lose. You said it. "It won't make you a lifetime winner".

    Essentially you're admitting you do this (DI and all the extra hours) for fun. It can't be to make money. You still expect to lose. All well and fine. I can do the same....and not have spent the equivalent of 5,000 extra hours twiddling my thumbs (plus second hand smoke) at the rail over a lifetime and doing something more worthwhile with that time. If fun is your goal...go for it. It's obviously not profit.
     
    #9
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2016
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  10. twodicebilly, Nov 2, 2016

    twodicebilly

    twodicebilly Member

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    Kokomojoe

    You don't need to be a dice controller to have good rolls, any one
    can. All over this country today people are having them that don't
    believe in it... the point is once you get it, you can win more
    often than you lose. I like the feeling of making a set adjustment
    and then beating the table.

    But don't listen to a kid like TDV... this is not a get rich thing, the
    difference is slight, you sure as hell don't do it for the money because
    the time it takes it may well not be worth it for most people.

    I like playing craps, and just like my hunting or fishing, I do
    everything I can to tip the odds in my favor.

    tdb
     
    #10
  11. KokomoJoe4, Nov 2, 2016

    KokomoJoe4

    KokomoJoe4 Member

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    That is also all I am looking for - better results. I do not expect them, but neither do I argue with them. If they come as I am shooting from the V6, I am sure as hell going to continue doing so!
     
    #11
  12. TDVegas, Nov 2, 2016

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    Well...which is it?
    Win more times? Hell, a simple modified martingale will do that if "win more times" is the goal. I believe OAP has outlined a +75% win rate...or more. The expectation is still to be net negative.--as you also state.

    Your own words admit you're not tipping the odds in your favor. You still expect to lose over a lifetime. Same as a randie. Your words basically indicate you are a randie...not a dice influencer. Well, not a good one.

    With $10,000 in pass line wagers
    $20,000 in odds wagers...(2x)

    $30,000 in wagers in total...

    The randie expects to lose $141.00. With a tiny bit of luck...might win.

    How much do you expect to lose as a DI?
     
    #12
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2016
  13. Dave G Ct, Nov 2, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    Twodicebilly
    I will let TD respond which he has already. Look DI is not rocket science.If there are that mainly variables according to you - TD is right- just random
     
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  14. TDVegas, Nov 2, 2016

    TDVegas

    TDVegas Member

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    Allow me to use an analogy for randie vs. tdb DI....
    2 people are chopping wood.
    TDVegas is using the TDV axe (randie axe)
    tdb is using the tdb axe (DI axe)

    We are both chopping an equal amount of wood (money)

    The only difference is the tdb axe (DI) needs double the time (IOW, waiting on the rail, practicing, etc.) to accomplish the same thing.

    Nothing wrong with that (like nothing wrong with DI)...maybe using the tdb axe is more fun...but in the end, my day is over at 1pm...you're still chopping wood till 5pm. Same amount of wood.

    If fun, enjoyment is the primary factor...then disregard this post. Go DI. Have fun.
     
    #14
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2016
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  15. KokomoJoe4, Nov 2, 2016

    KokomoJoe4

    KokomoJoe4 Member

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    Dave,

    You may or may not be right about DI and rocket science, but I can guarantee you that DI is NOT as simple as setting and keeping on-axis, and I'm pretty sure this is what you think is happening.

    I get visual proof, EVERY time I play the game, that on-axis IS NOT happening. It does happen by chance from time to time, but certainly no where near your "44% of the time." No need to guess about this.

    I commend you if you get good results shooting. But even if you are shooting the dice with better than average to good results, it isn't because you are shooting on-axis.
     
    #15

  16. Liman

    Liman Member

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    me too.

    whenever I board an aircraft, I have a compulsion to stamp my feet softly on the jetway while Im getting ready to board, its assures me the plane wont go down.
    Its worked so far and Im almost 62.

    and just like people question the ability of any DI shooter, people look at me like what the fuck is he doing, kicking the mud off his shoes? dancing? little did they know I just saved their lives and guaranteed a safe flight for them. people just don't appreciate how I know it works.

    btw, Im also the greatest tiger hunter on Long Island, and people also laugh at me, saying, there are no tigers on Long Island, and I just smile and say, yep, I told ya I am.
     
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  17. Dave G Ct, Nov 2, 2016

    Dave G Ct

    Dave G Ct Member

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    New terminology for KoKo- on axis results
     
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  18. KokomoJoe4, Nov 2, 2016

    KokomoJoe4

    KokomoJoe4 Member

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    :rolleyes:

    I will freely admit to not knowing much, but having learned the construction of the dice, I can confidently tell you what I have already told you 48 times - dice can not be made to stay on-axis with any kind of consistency.

    Just because you set a [6][4] point shooting out of the 2V, a [6][4] comeback winner does NOT mean you are on-axis, but at least the both of us will be happy with the result. ;)
     
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  19. tabletop123, Nov 2, 2016

    tabletop123

    tabletop123 Member

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    Dice are NOT meant to stay on Axis, & THEY DON'T! All of this bullshit about "All that counts is the top numbers that the dice end up on" is deluding yourself to THINKING that your dice are ending up on Axis!

    Listen.......Who the fuck cares if the dice are on Axis or not? Shooting on Axis is asking to shoot perfectly, & it ain't gonna happen!

    Just let the numbers hit that I have my money wagered on & I wouldn't give a shit if it's on axis, off axis, above, or underneath Axis! Just pay the motherfriggin winner PLEASE!
     
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  20. Liman

    Liman Member

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    what we all have to remember, before DI shooting/theory, there were actually people losing at the craps tables. Ah, the good ole days, (the casino execs are sitting in their offices shrugging their shoulders and also saying, yep, before DI, the good ole days when we made money at the craps tables)
     
    #20
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