Biased or Unfair Dice at your TABLE?

Discussion in 'Dice Influencing' started by SevenOut, Feb 12, 2017.

  1. SevenOut, Feb 12, 2017

    SevenOut

    SevenOut Member

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    'Actions have Consequences' is an example where a Casino feels they are being cheated by a Shooter and Players at a Craps Table.

    Better yet... Select a Casino with a Lawyer and undercover Officer of the Law.

    Your turn to shoot.

    The stickman pushes the five dice to you. Immediately the five dice are put into a bag, sealed by the Undercover Cop and a receipt is given to the Boxman / or Stickman, as evidence. This is all on the Casino's security camera(s) and those representing you, the cheated player.

    Your complaint is that the Dice are Biased in the favor of the Casino. You sue the Casino for $1,000,000 as punitive damages and what you have lost at the Craps table.

    Your attorney gets 50% and pays all expenses and Linaway as the expert witness. Had the dice not been Biased, their Dice Sets would have had some positive outcomes beyond those expected with 'fair dice'.

    The Casino settles out of Court. You live happily ever after.

    The Court has to determine if the Casino dice used are 'Biased' or 'Not Biased'. Not you... the victim.

    The Casino converts their Craps Table space into Bubble Craps machines. Craps crews are laid off. Cheaper labor just to maintain the Bubble. Casino keeps more of the winnings and they... live happily every after.

    TDV buys his new home of his dreams, the blue Shelby CSX6000 Series Cobra 427 S/C Cobra off the Showroom in Las Vegas, packs up everthing and opens up his own 'Bubble Craps Casino' in Ohio.
     
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  2. TDVegas, Feb 12, 2017

    TDVegas

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    Sounds good to me...but is there a warmer winter climate for this? Arizona? Florida? Maybe Palm Springs?
     
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  3. von duck, Feb 12, 2017

    von duck

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    This is all great fun, as are most ''wet dreams''. If a casino is rigging a dice game,and I am totally convinced some do, it would probably be in way that could not be determined by examining the dice. There is much talk about magnets, weighted dice, etc. but let me ask this question: what is possible that none of us knows, this is the problem. There is a "smoking gun" that tells me for sure that there is some asymmetric force acting on the dice. I do not know what the force is, I can't see it, but I can see its "shadow ". No other player has ever mentioned this phenomenon to me, perhaps they have never played with "straight dice" and don't know what's missing. I will have much more to say on this subject in the near future. Maybe just maybe, tell you what the "GUN" is.
    Farewell for now, Good Karma........
     
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  4. Onautopilot, Feb 12, 2017

    Onautopilot

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    I see that conspiracy theories are still alive and well.
     
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  5. TDVegas, Feb 12, 2017

    TDVegas

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    If you begin to question the legitimacy of the game, any game...I think you really only have one viable solution. Some people are not going to want to hear it....but...quit.

    I think my head would explode if each time I saw funky outcomes on bubble craps...that I began to question if there are magnets, pre set results or the game has been compromised in some manner. Once I held those thoughts....cash out button and you would never see me on the bubble again.

    I just could not bring myself to play again....wondering what's up this time. That, to me, is misery.

    The casino holds an edge in every damn game offered. It's not a compromised game...it's an advantage game. There are 75,000 hotel rooms up and down the strip attesting to that.
     
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  6. HornHiYo, Feb 13, 2017

    HornHiYo

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    It seems casinos have taken plenty of craps player bankrolls long before the biased dice story was told.
    Anyone know what is the difference in hands expected per buy in between biased and unbiased dice?
     
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  7. HornHighBLEVE, Feb 13, 2017

    HornHighBLEVE

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    In this day and age it's hard for anyone to keep secrets. So (imo) I doubt casinos would risk their reputation using bias dice...

    ...and just supposing they did?

    Eventually some math genius in the 'know' would make the proper deduction and come up with a betting strategy to win...

    ...just like the poster, Linaway, I believe, who tracks the numbers and develops a betting strategy.
     
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  8. TDVegas, Feb 13, 2017

    TDVegas

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    If you walk into a casino with an attitude "I need to keep watch if these guys are cheating me with fugazy dice".......you've already lost.

    To this day there is no credible evidence out of balance dice will even offer up bias results for the casino to profit by...or the player.

    I've got a spare 8 hours tomorrow. Show me bias dice and tell me the results I'll see.

    I'll even take it once step further. We can stop off and pick up a Monopoly board game from Target and break out those 2 cheap azz dice instead of regular craps dice. Still won't make a difference. The bias dice aficionado won't be able to discern bias from variance with either one.
     
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    Last edited: Feb 13, 2017
  9. KokomoJoe4, Feb 13, 2017

    KokomoJoe4

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    TD,

    Wish I could get a spare 8 hrs, I'd be to the casino in a flash.

    My problem is the boss - she is good to me at home but never gives me a weekday off. I'm not even allowed to get sick. :rolleyes:
     
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  10. TDVegas, Feb 13, 2017

    TDVegas

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    Yet you would never trade her in:).

    Couch it as a research project...not gambling. ;)
     
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  11. von duck, Feb 13, 2017

    von duck

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    Let's clear the air about conspiracies. Everyone knows that there has never been any conspiracy, perpetrated against anybody, in any place, at any time. There is no such thing, that's why they took the word out of the dictionary. They did however leave in the term conspiracy-theorist, which they defined as: Anyone that has an opinion that that in any way differs from the user of the term. I'm not a sore looser, or winer,or anything like that. I am however meticulous record keeper, and very observant player. I will present statistical "hard" evidence, as well as logical "soft" evidence. I also have some theoretical stuff ,which l know your all going to love. Ok,so used the word theory, "keep your jock-straps on" it just means idea, and that's what we're all here for, right? Oh yeah, and I do have the "smoking gun" and when l reveal what it is, most of you will probably agree that it is irrefutable evidence of dice tampering.
    Be back soon, good karma.
     
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  12. TDVegas, Feb 13, 2017

    TDVegas

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    Interesting. Ok, open mind.....but why not just reveal it now? I don't understand the "string along....check back later" mode.

    Everyone knows conspiracies have happened. The key word is evidence. Evidence of this nature should be strong, independent and verifiable. No he said, she said stuff.

    I'll check later. When do you think you might present evidence?
     
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  13. wonko33, Feb 13, 2017

    wonko33

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    I have a theory too, people who just hint stuff and promise to elaborate later on forums are just trolls. desperate for attention. I'll tell you more about it tomorrow ...
     
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  14. lone irish digit, Feb 13, 2017

    lone irish digit

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    Another Heavy sock puppet? I can Hardley wait for tomorrow...
     
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  15. von duck, Feb 13, 2017

    von duck

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  16. von duck, Feb 13, 2017

    von duck

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    First let me say that l played in Nevada for about 10 years and never thought the game was crooked, some of the crew was another matter all together. I first picked up on this thing in Biloxi. There is a thing that happens on a "straight" craps table,oh maybe a half dozen times or so in a days play. You know that thing where one cube has settled, but the other, is up on a corner spinning like a top for maybe 2-3-4-5 seconds. In 7 months of weekends in Biloxi, l saw only 1 "spinner" and it was only the 2 second variety. I should have seen dozens if not hundreds. So l ask, how can that be? The only plausible answer,was that there was some asymmetric force acting on the dice. There is more, reply to this, and I will be back tomorrow evening.
     
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  17. SevenOut, Feb 13, 2017

    SevenOut

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    Some time ago on this exact Forum, when I was mildly coherent... I said distinctly and in common English:

    "When I win at the Craps Table... honest dice."
    "When I lose at the Craps Table... biased dice."

    The problem with gamblers is they never blame themselves for their losses, but take all the credit for their wins. Even if the wins were possible by someone chucking dice from the other end of the table. Then it is considered 'Smart Craps Systems' at work. A totally foreign idea around here.

    My problem. I do have some biased dice from a major manufacturer of Casino 19mm / 3/4" acetate Dice. These were also not hot stamped with any Casino Logo as they were 'OBVIOUSLY' biased.

    Biased not from the spots being lighter or heavier.
    Biased not from the cube being something like a loaf of bread in appearance.
    Biased not from wear, flaws within the acetate... like elongated air bubbles.

    My examples are 'Perfect Dice' meant to be hot stamped with a Casino Logo... but the manufacturer knew by glancing at the color, shape, pips, edge options.... etc... that an occasional DIE is BIASED. (Just some clues to throw you off the scent...) But 100% true.

    Should I go on and tell you what the flaw(s) I DISCOVERED?

    Naw... I would want an 'unbiased person' who can examine these dice, upon a hard flat surface, without even touching the die, or dice and know they could be and are biased dice.

    If SuperRick and his wife will sit down to a Station Casino together with my wife and self... I will bring some examples of Biased Dice. But, Rick cannot disclose to anyone on this Forum how him and I determined a Biased Die from my 1,000's. Once the die / dice are agreed to be Biased... only then will I let Rick put his finger prints on any for further inspection.

    I just want Rick or TDV to make a statement that Biased Dice can be observed to be Biased without even shooting them by Chucking or Dice Setting... on this Thread on this Forum.

    Then all of you Dice Bias Cry Babies, requiring delicate special tools and equipment can just put a zipper to all of this nonsense, once and for all. Or least a few days...

    I would also accept TDV's opinion. Although not the Bouncing Melons he is comfortable with following... even TDV, after I explain what to look for on a Biased Die / Dice.

    The rest of you have NO CLUE what you are talking about.

    I include three photographs of Perfect Dice that are unbiased. This is what they are good for. The Biased Dice are so rare, that even I keep them as souvenirs and oddities. View attachment 3925 View attachment 3925 DSCN4937.jpg
     
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    Last edited: Feb 13, 2017
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  18. SevenOut, Feb 13, 2017

    SevenOut

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    My Craps Therapy has been effective. DSCN4936.jpg DSCN4937.jpg
     
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  19. TDVegas, Feb 14, 2017

    TDVegas

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    Felt was replaced with softer version plus thicker, softer underlayment. This is why you aren't seeing "spinners" anymore. It's not a "cooked" table or dice...they just softened the table up.

    Try spinning a top on a mattress.

    Beyond that...what you presented is not considered evidence that a casino has rigged the game of craps, is cheating you via conspiracy or inserted fugazy dice to steal your money. That's simply an anecdotal observation that what you observed now is different than before. There are numerous reasons this might happen. I just pointed out one.

    This stuff is reported night and day here.
    Magnets in the table.
    Out of balance dice only in favor of casino. Yeah, good one.
    Magnets in the bubble dice.
    Bubble craps is a slot machine.
    Rigged VP machines.
    Shuffle machine ensuring positive casino outcome for blackjack.

    If anyone has based their gambling on "I need to or have to win" or "I can win"....otherwise there is some fugazy force denying me---change hobbies. Craps isn't poker.

    These aren't conspiracy theories...these are single players usually griping about losses or they simply can't understand why they are losing. Hint, hint....it's a negative game. You will lose. Well, at least that's how the game is built...sans the lucky few.

    I had a good year on the bubble in 2016. 2017 so far has been anything but. I wonder when I can start to ponder "they started to tighten those things up"--(James Hall, Dec. 2016)
     
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  20. TDVegas, Feb 14, 2017

    TDVegas

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    Are we talking from a point of view that you rolled these "obvious" bias dice and noticed a bias result or are we simply talking a bias (I'll call it a bad die) dice where you saw/observed the flaw?
     
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