Even if I promise to correct all of your mistakes, free of charge? I can't believe that you are oblivious to the very lucrative benefits, of being able to say, "Von Duck, has my book in his library, don't you think you should have it in yours"? You might have to get a bigger mail box, to handle all of the orders. Give it some more thought, this is all for YOUR benefit Man.

JCinPA Most answers are to place the 6/8, I don't disagree that mathematically that is your best bet, however, I chart the numbers being shot by each shooter and bet accordingly. If you are going to bet two numbers, bet the numbers coming in....charting will tell you the numbers to bet. It could be the 6/8, 5/9 or 5/8. I'm sure you get the drift. If the dominant number coming in beating the mathematical expectation is a 7....don't bet the do side until you see 2 out of 3 buck the 7 trend or play the don't. I do believe in one hit and down or if you are ahead and the table trend is hot, go for 2 hits and down. Did you know if you bet $44 inside, it will take 5 hits on the inside numbers before you are ahead of your ahead of your one hit and down. If you need a chart on that I will gladly post it for you.

Thank you, six shooter, I appreciate the reply. I don't see me ever charting numbers, though. I believe you get streaks where there are fewer sevens, and you get streaks where there are more, and I would try to take advantage of that. But I'm counting on streaks of more or less sevens to help me, I'm still going to place numbers more likely to hit, and that's the 6/8. I've seen shooters hit three 4's fours in a row, but that's not going to make we want to buy the 4. I've seen guys recording the numbers at the table, and it just seems pointless to me. It's interesting how many different ways people play, though. I'm for lower bankroll variance rather than big wins, and will follow 777's advice on starting with smaller bets and working up more odds when a streak hits, but gradually, pocketing wins along the way. I appreciate everyone who has taken the time to reply, though, very much.

Let’s do the six shooter math, shall we? One hit and down +$14. Five hits and down +$70. Five hits and seven out. $70-$44=$26. So what is average? Three hits and you lose $2 So what’s the math? You lose 14 cents for every six and eight you bet. So what’s the conclusion? Live with the math or learn to reduce sevens.

This is a partial book of rolls, 457, from my last two bubble sessions. Since I'm more of a "it's due" type of bettor I'll be betting for comeout sevens and fewer PSO's next session. Never have seen a graph get this far from a true distribution in this large a sample. FWIW, SRR is 6.53 in this sample. There's more to the equation than just fewer sevens in an individual session.

If I read the chart correctly and throw in the assumption that the fifth non-seven roll is a box number, which triggers the 5-count, a straight 5-counter would have skipped 44 of the 70 hands ( about 63%, more than the 57% touted by Frank Scoblette) of the hands in the sample. Of course there is no way to tell if this would have been to his/her benefit. In fact, I would think it to be inapplicable since that method requires the presence of a DI to "zero in on" for its efficacy. So nevermind; I just thought I'd post to say I have nothing to say...and take comfort from the resource errors knowing that all is quiet on the forum front.

Yesterday I tried to post a couple pictures of graphs and kept getting a "file to large" error. Had to set my camera to email quality pictures to get this one to upload. I never have been a fan of the five count. If funds are low and time is long I could see where it would have some merit. Especially so in venues where alcoholic drinks are free if you're a drinker. I only drink coffee so hanging at a table for free drinks isn't part of my game.

The only "merit" the five count has, is that you make substantially fewer bets. I can sit at home, and NOT BET. It's a stupid concept, period!

von duck Stupid concept????????? The vast majority of the money you lose betting on other players is on rolls of 5 or less shots...…...seems to me the stupid concept is to not accept that as reality and avoid those loses as much as you can. Anyone that has applied the concept, particularly the player that wants to make sure the majority of the money he bets is on his shot, will tell you of the value of the 5 count. in 2008 I was playing in Laughlin and I was using the five count everyday I was there, and the first couple of days I caught all kinds of shit from a couple of the crew because they did not want to fiddle with the bet and they said a number of times exactly what you said. The last day of the trip when i was ahead for the trip a women was asking the guy what I was doing and he explained it to her better than I could have and indicated he had been watching it for several days before he understand the value of it. The five count is not for the gambler. but it a good tool for the good player. TDB

Wow von duck, You are assuming that the "Average Shooter is as GOOD AS You ARE"", with the above... That does NOT SAY MUCH ABOUT YOUR SHOOTING!!! At that rate, I WOULD NOT BET ON EITHER OF YOU... eagleeye2!

The "average" shooter, IS as good as me, since I claim no skill with the dice. Never have. Pick them up, and fling them, with no control of the outcome whatever. I'm as random, as the dice I'm throwing,

That's my opinion too. If you don't have a bet on the table you're not playing craps. I probably go against the grain of every charter because I only chart a roll if I have a bet on the table. If you aren't betting, a roll of the dice is irrelevant. It doesn't matter if you're standing next to the table or at home chasing ma around the bed. The dice roll will make no difference to your bankroll if you don't have a bet.. If biased dice existed I may change my mind. After charting 40,000 plus rolls I've found no evidence of biased dice so that thought no longer enters the equation.

missthis1 That's my opinion too. If you don't have a bet on the table you're not playing craps. Well...that is certainly one way to play TDB

In defense of the five count, it certainly won't hurt your chances, just slows everything down. "No harm, No foul"